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Cruiser on veg oil


 
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GAZZA
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Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 47
Location: berkshire

PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 16:35    Post subject: Cruiser on veg oil Reply with quote

After thinking about getting shot of my trusty old cruiser for a while i have decided that i cant replace it with anything better or more reliable or cheaper to run (unless i have more cash of course).but i think im gonna get it converted properly to run on veg oil,has anyone done it already??the web seems to be full of sites saying its great but there must be a catch???any info greatly received .thanks and Merry Xmas
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Wandering Willy
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Joined: 18 Jul 2007
Posts: 1016
Location: Norfolk

PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 17:40    Post subject: Veg Oil Reply with quote

If you want to run on untreated vegetable oil, this company in Wolverhampton is the only one I have come across in the UK which has sorted out most of the bits needed  to do the job properly:-

http://dieselveg.com/

The web site also has a page pointing out which engines (mainly the injection pump) can work well on untreated veg oil (and which ones don't!).

Untreated veg oil is much more viscous at normal temperatures than diesel oil. You need a more powerful pump at the tank to push the cold oil up to the engine. Then you fit a heater to the fuel filter which heats the oil so that its viscosity falls to a similar value to cold diesel oil. You can also fit trace heaters (like heated ribbons) to the injector pipes. You need a second small fuel tank to hold a small quantity of normal diesel oil to start the car on and to flush out the vegetable oil just before switching off so that the cold engine can cope with starting. Obviously, when the engine is warm the veg oil flows around the engine more easily but not when it is stone cold.

If you want to use treated vegetable oil, it's a different matter as the oil has been processed with meths and caustic soda to make it much runnier like diesel oil. If this is done properly the result is perfectly acceptable but if you saw last Sunday's Top Gear they blew up the injection pump on a BMW 330 by running it on vegetable oil with too much meths left in it which dissolved the pump seals.

Commercially produced bio-diesel can be purchased from processors in quantities from 25 to 1000 litres at around 90-95 p per litre.

It does 'wax' in cold weather. Below about 4 degrees C it turns into a white waxy mixture. To see this try storing a bottle of cooking oil in your fridge for a few days. The wax blocks the pipe from the fuel tank and the car won't run till the weather warms up. Using a 50/50 mixture with garage diesel fuel is usually enough to manage this problem unless it is very cold.

Also, you will need to change the fuel filter after about 200 miles as the bio-diesel flushes the gunge out of the fuel tank and pipework which will also block it. It is a once only problem.

I hope this helps

Willy
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radiomans
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Joined: 06 Aug 2005
Posts: 48
Location: Bury, Lancs, UK IO83UO

PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 16:09    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Gazza

Well i run my Prado on 100% pure veg oil no probs.

I have a glowplug heater heater that is mounted right by the injection pump
which heats up the oil for an easy start in the mornings, i also have
a heat exchanger(useing the water from the heater pipes) this is put in line before the fuel filter.
Mines setup so that once the rad water gets hot, it then turns off the 12v glowplug heater,
and keeps the veg oil hot by the heat exchanger

Radiomans
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1996 Prado 3.0td TX Auto LWB Import on 100% veg oil
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eclaire
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Joined: 15 Dec 2007
Posts: 33

PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 17:50    Post subject: Reply with quote

smartveg.co.uk also sell a twin tank kit that they tell me is suitable for a cruiser. am due to collect my cruiser before the new year (R plate) and one of the first jobs will be a twin tank SVO conversion
claire:-}
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eclaire
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Joined: 15 Dec 2007
Posts: 33

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 21:58    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well going on my current limited experience dont go there!!

We had a dieselveg fitted kit 3 weeks ago and its not right at all. The kit is very neatly fitted and looks a good job.

I have upped the purge from the 2 mins they told me to 3 mins and she starts fine on that but once she goes onto pure oil you loose a load of power and get a flat spot/misfire at 1100rpm.

I am now back running on diesel out of the tiny tank (ie filling it each day) until we work out what to do next to try and improve the situation. A fuel filter heater or mixing diesel into the oil are probably the next things to try but at this present moment in time I wouldnt recomend this conversion to anyone!!

Claire:-}
Daisy, 1997 24v, GX manual
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Towpack
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Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 1314
Location: Sheffield

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 23:18    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem with raw veg oil is the glycerine content which gives the oil it's heavy viscosity and is  the component removed when turning veg oil into refined bio deisel.When burned the glycerine can cause gradual build up of deposits in the combustion chambers and injectors.
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Phil


1998 HDJ80 Amazon VX 4.2TD
2004 Yamaha R1 (Sold)
2011 Ducati 1198SP (Sold)
2012 kawasaki ZZr1400
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2010 Husaberg FE570....YIPPEEEEE!!!!
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eclaire
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Joined: 15 Dec 2007
Posts: 33

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:39    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is not supposed to be a problem if the oil is hot enough on injection.......I say supposed because that is what dieselveg told me but i have no faith in their words now!
claire:-}
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Towpack
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Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 1314
Location: Sheffield

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 19:54    Post subject: Reply with quote

The buildup of any deposits is supposed to take many thousands of miles so it's very unlikely this is the problem you have.More likely it's a system setup problem and just needs a bit of tweeking.
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Phil


1998 HDJ80 Amazon VX 4.2TD
2004 Yamaha R1 (Sold)
2011 Ducati 1198SP (Sold)
2012 kawasaki ZZr1400
2002 Honda XR650R (BRP)- STOLEN GRRRRR!!!
2010 Husaberg FE570....YIPPEEEEE!!!!
2003 GT XCR3000
1995 Border Collie-Passed away 23-5-2011
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Graham Stirling
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Joined: 18 May 2007
Posts: 156
Location: Perthshire

PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 22:14    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it helps i've done 50k + miles with a dieselveg kit in my l200 pickup, i found that fitting a check valve in the return feed pipe made a big difference. I also run my 80 on 60% veg in the main tank. It starts fine but surges until it's warm, takes about 3-5 mins at tickover to stop the surging. Lower concentrations run fine from cold but i'm skint so i run it as thick as i can get away with. Both have passed mots recently wth no probs. G
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eclaire
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Joined: 15 Dec 2007
Posts: 33

PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2008 8:12    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks graham, she is supposed to be going back this week - seeing as we paid dieselveg £1200 to convert it i would like it to run 110% right
cheers
claire:-}
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Ian-P
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Joined: 28 Sep 2005
Posts: 108
Location: Forest Deer, N Dorset.

PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 18:48    Post subject: Reply with quote

I installed a DieselVeg kit in my 80 about 20 months ago. I also installed an OEM auxiliary tank and dual filler. I modified the original kit by adding a separate fuel filter, and having the return line switch tanks rather than circulate back to the pump. The kit has worked well, the only problems being an initial mistake in plumbing by myself, a diesel bug infection, and at the moment Iím having problems filtering the oil due to the cold weather.

Hope you managed to get the problems sorted Claire.
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4.2 TD 12v VX AUTO
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eclaire
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Joined: 15 Dec 2007
Posts: 33

PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 18:50    Post subject: Reply with quote

just an update - she is now running 80/20 oil/diesel mix which is running well. Daisy is a 24valve and i think Ian's is a 12v. Maybe the 12's work better on the oil???
claire:-}
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TONKAGS 24v
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Joined: 19 Jul 2010
Posts: 19
Location: ALTON HANTS

PostPosted: Sun Oct 31, 2010 16:44    Post subject: Reply with quote

eclaire wrote:
just an update - she is now running 80/20 oil/diesel mix which is running well. Daisy is a 24valve and i think Ian's is a 12v. Maybe the 12's work better on the oil???
claire:-}



[At LAST a fellow 24v owner!! I'm sure most of my problems have been due to the fact that the 24valve is a little more delicate with smaller valves and a more complex system. Parts are less numerous, especially injectors. I'm running a high ratio of one micron filtered waste veg oil as  a cocktail with Total Xelium and injector cleaner- shaken AND stirred!!  Rolling Eyes
It's running rough as a cats tongue on the oil but I know the injectors need changing-out. Got another re-conned set from Australia to go in. Once this is done, will NOT be using any freaky "alternative" fuel chemical mix weirdness again as a bad batch of BOYO-diesel destroyed a brand new set of genuine Yota injectors and melted the tops of all six pistons!!
Knock on effects have been HUGE and are still ongoing. Partly because I've yet to find a reliable mechanic who really knows these engines (24v) ;-(. Good luck![code]
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vegmondo
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Joined: 13 Dec 2010
Posts: 11
Location: dorset

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 20:54    Post subject: Reply with quote

eclaire
They will help you out,ive done 50,000miles on my diesel veg kit on out bongo(dont laugh )

I reckon you poss may just have put too much veg in tank.add a little more diesel and everything can change,In the summer you will be laughing!
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