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LJ70 Gearbox Issues


 
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gus2010
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Joined: 18 Oct 2004
Posts: 46
Location: Vehicle is in Scotland, I visit it once a year from Australiark Saudi, soon Australia

PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2018 16:26    Post subject: LJ70 Gearbox Issues Reply with quote

So....
Running my 1991 LJ70 again for the first time in several years.
Just drove it 160 miles from Aberdeen to parents house.

Running sweetly, but gearbox is a bit of a problem child.
It runs through the gears easily with the engine off and the clutch either in or out, so I don't think there is an issue with the linkages.

But once running, gearchanges are difficult.
Can't find the gates without a lot of crunching.
I think it is the synchro?

New oil was put into both gearboxes and the diffs, before any driving, so that is all fresh.
The clutch is fine too.

Someone has told me that after a long while lying idle this can happen, but will often sort itself out?
But if not then changing the oil for Automatic transmission oil (which has different fluid characteristics) will usually solve the problem.
However, popped into the local Toyota dealer who (unsurprisingly) said that the only solution was a full gearbox strip down and rebuild.

I don't trust anyone local to do this and don't want to go down this route unless it is truly my only option.
I'm still planning to drive the vehicle from Scotland to Anglesey on the 29th where it will remain at my sister's place.

The engine is torquey enough that I can pull away in 2nd from standstill without issues, and then at slightly higher speed and revs than normal, slip it cleanly into 4th.
Providing the vehicle is rolling at about 60, and preferably under low load (eg downhill) I can then mostly get it into 5th and then roll for miles like that.
So I should be able to get the journey to Anglesey done hopefully without too much stress.
But running it long term like that will just cause damage (and even more expense) to the box.

So, I'm asking the brains' trust on this forum, two things:

1.  Are there any low cost solutions that have a chance of solving this problem?
2.  If not, can anyone recommend a specialised gearbox place local to Anglesey, or within say 100miles of Anglesey, that would do a good job of this for a reasonable cost?


As always, thanks in advance to everyone reading / responding to my plea !
Regards,
Angus
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2018 16:26    Post subject: Google Ads keep this community free to join!


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Roger Fairclough
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Joined: 24 Oct 2007
Posts: 1619
Location: Redditch Worcestershire

PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2018 21:31    Post subject: Reply with quote

The gear lever pivots on a nylon bearing which sometimes breaks up. This restricts gear changing. You need to remove the tray around the gear lever to access the top of the box to remove the lever. Should take about an hour at most. The nylon bearing is available on it,s own. Worth a check.

Roger
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gus2010
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Joined: 18 Oct 2004
Posts: 46
Location: Vehicle is in Scotland, I visit it once a year from Australiark Saudi, soon Australia

PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 14:43    Post subject: Follow Up Reply with quote

OK, so... it's pretty much terminal.  
I put the vehicle into a specialist gearbox centre.  'box has been run with insufficient lube at some time (was full when they stripped it down though).  So Input Driveshaft and Layshaft need replacement, and at the same time they will change some of the bearings in the box in general and most / all of the synchros.  Having problems sourcing the shafts.  Apparently at least one component is no longer made.  Donor box would be an option, but nothing readily available on the usual places so far.  Looking as far afield as Australia (where i work).

Part numbers are Lay Shaft 33421-35120 (which MAY have been superseded by 33421-60151, but I'm not certain), may also be known as the Counter Gear?
and Input Shaft 33301-35090.

Anybody know of any place that has a stock of New Old Stock Toyota Drive Train bits?
I almost got lucky on Australian e bay but the part numbers were different and they won't fit.

Anybody got any ideas? Sources?
Thanks,
Angus
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andy
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Joined: 16 Dec 2003
Posts: 2258
Location: Polegate, Sussex, England.

PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 16:16    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you tried http://www.euro4x4parts.com/parts/vfv1024-0_layshaft_cluster_gear_33421-60151.html
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It's Not a Bl**dy Jeep it's a Landcruiser
150 series Invincible X
100 Series VX Limited
Mercedes Sprinter 311 Luton
1993 VX80 4.2td SOLD
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andy
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Joined: 16 Dec 2003
Posts: 2258
Location: Polegate, Sussex, England.

PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 18:48    Post subject: Reply with quote

Or another one https://www.amayama.com/en/genuine-catalogs/toyota
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It's Not a Bl**dy Jeep it's a Landcruiser
150 series Invincible X
100 Series VX Limited
Mercedes Sprinter 311 Luton
1993 VX80 4.2td SOLD
1996 Hilux Surf SSR-G Intercooler Sold
1994 Hilux Surf SSR-V Sold
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gus2010
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Joined: 18 Oct 2004
Posts: 46
Location: Vehicle is in Scotland, I visit it once a year from Australiark Saudi, soon Australia

PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 14:24    Post subject: Follow up Reply with quote

Oh, dear lord, what a nightmare,
Thank you all for your help.  I ordered both parts from Euro4x4, who were very helpful, but one part was wrong and the other part should have fitted but didn't.  Thankfully Euro4x4 promised that if if the parts weren't right they would take them back, and they have.

The gearbox specialist have been amazing, and gone to enormous lengths to try to source the parts, but have come up blank.  As have I - I didn't take the risk of the other recommendation because at about $500 each shaft, I didn't want to end up with an incorrect part I couldn't return.

The gearbox specialist have suggested that the 'box fitted might be a hybrid, because it is different to what it "should" be, ie the number of teeth on the gears are not as the available spares indicate they should be.

For example:
The teeth count on the lay shaft that came out of the gearbox are:  1st=11, 2nd=21, 3rd=32, 4th=43, R=13 (5th must be engaged in a different way)
But the teeth count on the shaft from Euro4x4 is:  1st=12, 2nd=23, other gears the same so far as I know.
With these differences, the gearbox could not be rebuilt, and is little better than what it was.
This is a disastrous result for me.
Does anyone know any explanation for this?

I'll add more info as I collate it from various sources.
Thank you,
Angus
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gus2010
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Joined: 18 Oct 2004
Posts: 46
Location: Vehicle is in Scotland, I visit it once a year from Australiark Saudi, soon Australia

PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2022 18:23    Post subject: Update on the thread above Reply with quote

Hello all,
Hard to believe about 2 years has passed since my last update on this.  

Context:  I originally bought the vehicle about 2004.  Put a new (Jap import) engine into it in 2005 after the head went.  Emigrated to Australia in 2006, leaving the vehicle in UK.  Ended up selling it in 2016, only to buy it back in 2018 and inherited the GearBox problem.  I still live in Australia so only have access and use of this car for about a month every year.

I struggled with the gearbox problem, as did the specialist I gave the vehicle to.  I will not name them.  They put a lot of effort in, but it seems they missed a basic bit of trouble shooting.  Their diagnosis was as per above.  I did alert them to the tip given by Roger Fairclough, but it seems they never investigated that possibility.  None of us could get the parts they recommended to rebuild the gearbox.  Last ditch effort - I went onto the breaker website (can't remember exact name) and sourced a replacement low mileage box from a place in Glastonbury (very good, 350 quid delivered to the GB specialist).  Gearbox specialist assessed it, said it was good and fitted it.  The old box was scrapped.

I went to pickup the vehicle and the gearshift was EXACTLY the same as it was before.  It doesn't take a genius to deduce that thus, the problem was probably NOT the original (or the replacement) 'box.

I limped the car back to Scotland, and followed up on Roger's suggestion.  I sourced the two parts required from local Toyota dealer (about 25 quid).  Dismantled the centre console, removed the shift lever and there it was - the bushing had disintegrated into sugar-grain sized particles. I changed that out and the little nylon, ummm nipple thing that goes right on the end ball (although it looked OK).  The hardest part of the process was getting the console tray off the transmission tunnel!  

Reassembled the whole thing and immediately the shift was almost back to normal.  It has an occasional miss / or difficulty getting into a gear, but I think a bit of the nylon bushing might have got into the gearbox, so a flush and oil change may be required.

So, thanks to everyone who contributed to this post, and especially to Roger.  The lesson learned here is if you have a shift problem with this type of vehicle and 'box, then save yourself a lot of hassle and potential cost and investigate that bushing first.  For the record, I THINK it is the R150 or R151 'box that is fitted to my vehicle.

Regards,
Angus
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