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Help with no start on 1993 3.0 TD 1KZ-TE Prado

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Gandalf
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Joined: 19 Nov 2016
Posts: 37
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 2:18    Post subject: Update: Started, runs briefly Reply with quote

Ok more progress.

After more double-checking all wiring to Spill Control Valve relay and ECD main relay, I determined that the only reason that the vehicle was not at least firing up and coughing a bit to show life was that the SVR was not being activated at all, and the only possible fault is that the SVR pin is not being connected inside the ecu. It is the ground for the SVR relay (lead #2 if you examine the SVR relay function/testing).

I unplugged the SVR pin from harness connector A (E6) and grounded the SVR pin. The engine caught and started immediately, but ran for only 2 seconds, and then did not catch again with subsequent IGN-start attempts.
I primed the fuel filter, and once again the engine caught right away, running smooth (at least with regards to my experience with a cold diesel engine that hasn't run in a year or more) but again for only 2 seconds.
The prime (as felt in the fuel filter prime pumper) seemed to have dissipated, so I primed again. Same result, engine starts right away but only runs 2 seconds.

This time I look closely at all warning lights during the brief running, and all of them (flashing timing bulb during cranking, solid on Engine Warning bulb with IGN-on)  go out as per normal operation. To me, this isolates the starting/ignition issue (aside from determining whether it be either an ecu issue or ecu pinout mis-identification) and means it's close to operation.

I looked at that Engine Speed Sensor again, and sure enough there is fuel sweating from the threads around it. I tighten the ring at it's base just a smidgen, and the sweating seems to get worse, and bubbles are forming in the fuel all around the Engine Speed Sensor. When I prime with the hand-pump at the fuel filter, fuel/air bubbles out the threads. So I'm gathering that this will at least contribute to an air/suction/pressure/prime problem and prevent continuous running... I'll focus efforts on that for now.

Any suggestions welcome.
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Gandalf
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Joined: 19 Nov 2016
Posts: 37
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 3:07    Post subject: Reply with quote

Engine Speed Sensor itself tested, showed 330 ohm at 0 degrees C (it should be 205-255 at 20 degrees C)... so it may fall into spec with increased temperatures. I cannot find any details as to specifics about the Engine Speed Sensor installation, other than just a recommendation of "tighten the sensor" if it needs it. :/ Any experience welcome.
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Roger Fairclough
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Joined: 24 Oct 2007
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Location: Redditch Worcestershire

PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 18:30    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the speed sensor has a taper thread, use PTFE tape on the thread.

Roger
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Gandalf
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Joined: 19 Nov 2016
Posts: 37
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 23:07    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, I'll check and try it, if there is any more sweating... in the meantime I came up with an o-ring on the outside, over the sensor, and squished beneath the lock-clip. It seems to have sealed. I doubt that this leak is/was causing the current symptoms though, I discovered that there isn't a need now to prime it after each start attempt, but the IGN must be turned completely off in between attempts. That tells me that there is something electronic/ecu-related that is halting normal operation after 2 seconds, which is then reset after IGN-off. Again, no warning lights. I'll check again and see if there is a code remembered that isn't causing a warning light.
Good tip!
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Gandalf
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Joined: 19 Nov 2016
Posts: 37
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 3:35    Post subject: Reply with quote

Went back and checked, sure enough, warning code 99 was once again in memory in the ecu. It doesn't cause the engine warning light to come on, unless you go into diagnostics mode, then it will blink it out. I previously had not rechecked for codes after it was starting briefly.

With ecu reset, the engine catches right away, then runs perfect for four seconds, all the while the warning light blinks  it's "nothing" steady stream of flashes... then engine cuts out and the warning code 99 begins. So it is sending out data from the IMO pin (reads around 12v) and expects reformed data back on the IMI pin (which reads low voltage.028v - .04v jumping around with IGN on). Those voltages don't change significantly throughout IGN-on, running, or cutout.. When those two pins are directly connected, it makes no difference, I think the ecu is expecting a reformed version of the data it sends out. Grrr. person who sold the ecu should refund, all keys/codes/blah-blah was requested with the ecu.

Any info on IMI and IMO pins is now Most Wanted #1 lol
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Gandalf
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Joined: 19 Nov 2016
Posts: 37
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 7:26    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok,
It is determined that the only reason that this 1993 Prado 1KZ-TE engine isn't running perfectly on this 89661-60560 ecu is because of a lack of immobilizer and matching keys/keyring. If a person were to have a matching immobilizer, keys and keyring, this ecu could be reprogrammed to accept the new keys, and this ecu swap is a go. I took a video to show the startup, will post it tomorrow.

Before I go forward with finding the above components, I will go over the original ecu (89661-60250) one more time, with my microscope, and determine every trace is intact, and examine why the extra wires exist on the board, and check all caps and resistors for issues. Sigh. I got the ecu back from another electronics shop, and they couldn't find anything wrong. Grrr.
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Gandalf
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Joined: 19 Nov 2016
Posts: 37
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 13:57    Post subject: Reply with quote

Video of startup on the 1998 ecu, and the immobilizer shutting it down, perhaps someone will go that route and finish the ecu swap:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GyuQfTJBVk
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Gandalf
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Joined: 19 Nov 2016
Posts: 37
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 14:02    Post subject: SOLVED! Reply with quote

Got it!!
Found another broken trace that everybody missed. It was inconspicuous... probably due to the nearby distracting discoloration/corrosion on this road-warrior board... almost looked like a stain over top of the trace. But when tested for continuity there was none. It was the short trace that went to the negative leg on the cap in the pic below... I soldered in a short wire on the back of the board. No codes now. Started instantly.



The additional 3 wires that were on this board are from 3 previously repaired traces... I also found that one of those wires (from C9) was rubbing and exposed onto the solder-spot of the C22 pin... that may cause issues for when the tranny is in neutral, and constrictor control of the intake... but of course we never progressed to a running vehicle until now. I added an external sheath with shrink-tube and changed the solder-wire angle:



Here are the other three traces that were previously repaired... or rather, what's left of them. Sections were entirely evaporated.



Thanks very much for the help guys... bit of a learning curve being unfamiliar with this vehicle.

------------------------------
CyKlops Custom Creations
mk15.ca
3sgte@mk15.ca
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andy
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Joined: 16 Dec 2003
Posts: 2168
Location: Polegate, Sussex, England.

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 14:30    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well done for sorting this, I don't think I would have got that far with the problems.
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Gandalf
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Joined: 19 Nov 2016
Posts: 37
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2017 12:53    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Andy!
It helps to be *beep*, obsessed, and stubborn :p
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Spearomike
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Joined: 27 Jul 2022
Posts: 1
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2022 0:22    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Guys, this is my first post here.

Sorry to dredge this thread up from a zillion years ago. I had similar issues to what Gandalf described here and this thread really helped me out so I just wanted to pass on my thanks.

I noticed my truck (kzj95) refusing to glow so I checked out the fuses and relays for the glow system, the same for the ECU. No SREL Signal from the ECU flicking the glow relay. ECU power/earth/switch power/start signal all good.

Pulled the lid of the ECU, sure enough dead caps:

Image to come after approval from a mod

I'm familiar with these from the silvertop 4age engines, no big deal. Ordered some caps and refitted them. ECU back in the hole, glowed and started once then no glow again

After googling the pinouts for 1KZTE I ended up in this thread on your forum. After reading this thread and seeing Gandalf's issue I thought id pull the ECU again and check the tracks out

Image to come after approval from a mod

Felt kind of stupid for not checking it the first time. Ran the multimeter across either end of the massive burned area, zero continuity. Soldered a jumper on the back to bridge the gap and shes running mint again

Thank you guys for your great resource and thanks Gandalf for sharing your issue. May this thread help some other poor soul with an upset 1kz!

Cheers
Mike
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